For Those Who Lost The 33 Seed Words

Discussion in 'Seeds' started by RegenX, Feb 19, 2016.

  1. 2017/12/15 - Decred v1.1.2 released! → Release Notes  → Downloads
  1. michael sørensen

    Translator (Dansk)

    Jan 1, 2016
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    - Did I accuse you of doing it?
    ^ No.



    It's still your own fault. For trusting a random dude online. - Even after you were explicitly told, NOT to give your seed to anyone. (Anyone, includes mods, developers, founders, your mom. Yeah, basicly EVERYONE...)


    Aaaight, if you say so.
    - Who's fault is it then, if it's not yours?
     
  2. LastNinja

    LastNinja Full Member

    Dec 31, 2015
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    Insulting others won't bring your coins back. Open a thread and document the case like it was done in the "Blizzy is a thief" thread.
     
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  3. RegenX

    RegenX Jr. Member

    Jan 2, 2016
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    btw, there are glitches in the decred wallet system, as has been proven by the difficulties that others have had
    with mining and wallets.
    So don't make judgements and generalizations like 'it was in fact entirely your fault, you are trying to make it out to be
    everyone elses fault' etc.

    That is clearly not true.
     
  4. michael sørensen

    Translator (Dansk)

    Jan 1, 2016
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    I'm just gonna move on now.
     
  5. RegenX

    RegenX Jr. Member

    Jan 2, 2016
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    I will do that. I just don't like being judged as being 'entirely n the wrong' after being stolen from. The fact that the airdrop was free doesn't make it any less a case of theft.
     
  6. michael sørensen

    Translator (Dansk)

    Jan 1, 2016
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    People always see critique, as an attack. <.<
     
  7. RegenX

    RegenX Jr. Member

    Jan 2, 2016
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    I edited some of the anger from my post, but it was too late, you had already hit reply

    I didn't interpret the critique as an attack as much as I interpreted it as being judgmental and I interpreted 'the critique' as being something that
    would be used to dismiss the actions of a thief as having been the fault of the person who was stolen from.
    I fucked up first by losing the paper that I had my seed written on, and second by giving to the seed words to someone who lied to me.
    I have never disputed that.
    I am not blaming you or anyone else for that.
    But I reserve the right to point out that in the end this would not be happening without the thief who is central to this
    story being the thief who did this.
    I made mention of the fact that part of this was due to the glitches at the wallet site. Read that . Part. The word
    that I used , carefully chosen, was the word partially. That means that things beyond my own control and outside of my own error contributed to this. I have never meant to imply that the glitches in the wallet registration system were the entire cause of this happening, or meant to imply that I was without error in this.
    I would be an asshole to come here and claim that I was error free and claim that I was entitled to free money and to demand perfection of
    everyone while ignoring my own errors, so I made a point of not doing that.
    I appreciate all of the work which has gone into creating t his opportunity for people.
     
  8. Kandiru

    Kandiru Member

    Feb 21, 2016
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    #28 Kandiru, Mar 2, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2016
    At the end of the day, stealing is a matter for the police. They can then make a formal request for Jessie's information held here, if they care enough. It should be a pretty easy case for them, assuming Jessie didn't use Tor and a fresh email address for everything.
     
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  9. koolykg

    koolykg Jr. Member
    Advocate (Facebook)

    Jan 1, 2016
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    That is not the same analogy. When someone gets mugged that is an unfortunate situation. You gave your seed away, which means you gave your coins away. There are times that I have to stop playing the victim and start taking responsibility for my actions. I am sorry about what happened to you, I truly am, but once again you set yourself up.
     
  10. RegenX

    RegenX Jr. Member

    Jan 2, 2016
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    #30 RegenX, Mar 3, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2016
    I did not give my coins away. I was lied to and told that my coins were being deposited into a new wallet for me by someone who appeared to be a developer.

    Its like locking your car keys with your wallet inside your car, finding yourself locked out of your car. You ask for help, and someone identifying themselves as a locksmith offers to unlock your car for you.

    But instead of helping you, the locksmith steals your car and your wallet instead.

    You ask for help from the police, and the police say:

    "You idiot, you just gave your car away. Everyone knows better than to do that. Fuck off."

    real logical stuff here , folks
     
  11. ClokworkGremlin

    ClokworkGremlin Sr. Member

    Jan 10, 2016
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    Whatever I want.
    #31 ClokworkGremlin, Mar 3, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2016
    Dude, his ribbon said "advocate." All of the developers have ribbons that say "developer," and they wouldn't ask you for your 33-word seed (as you hopefully learned from your later interactions with David)

    I think kooly is a little out of line, but there are two sides to this sort of thing: helping the victim cope with what happened and get on with their life, and helping them prepare so that it won't happen again. You know what they say. "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

    You were duped, yes, and no, it's not right to blame you, but you do need to learn from the experience, and the simple fact is that if the guy using the obvious Breaking Bad reference for a handle conned you, you made it really easy for him.

    1: You failed to do basic sanity checking: how does it make sense for a developer to be wearing an "advocate" badge? Not even all of the people with developer badges are developers. Davecgh isn't a Decred developer, he worked on the Bitcoin software that Decred was adapted from, and has stated himself that he doesn't code for Decred because he doesn't have time. I got offered a Developer ribbon, and the last time I wrote a single line of code that wasn't for personal pet projects was in 2012.
    2: You were much too trusting. You sent your key off to this guy AFTER [edit]the incident where blizzy stole coins from bttjob this exact same way[/edit], AFTER being told repeatedly that the seed allows anyone who has it to generate your wallet and use your coins, after everyone who used the example key on the airdrop website lost their coins because they were using a key that basically anyone could access, and did as soon as that airdrop was unlocked, after several people gave anecdotes that you should never trust anybody in Crypto(that's the whole point of Crypto, after all), and that the developers can't really do anything about lost or stolen seeds or coins. And then what happened after you caught him trying to scam you? YOU DID IT AGAIN! There are numerous tutorials on this forum for getting your wallet set up and transferring your coins around, use those, learn a few good tricks, don't trust other people with your money. That's the whole point of cryptocoins.
    3: When Dave came along to help you and told you not to tell him your seed or let him see it, what did you do? YOU TRIED TO SHOW HIM YOUR SEED! Frankly at this point we've crossed the line from simple ignorance into actively trying to get scammed. You wouldn't run around tearing checks out of your checkbook and giving them to people with no numbers written in. You wouldn't hand your credit card to random strangers. You shouldn't give your wallet seed or private keys to anybody who you don't want emptying that wallet, even if you trust them completely. They don't want the burden of that trust.

    Frankly at this point if you came to me for help, I'd have half a mind to clean your wallet out(if it even had anything left) and send it to a holding wallet for a few days just to teach you a lesson. Your cryptocoins would be safer in my hands than yours.

    You were scammed. Jesse broke the rules. It sucks. I'm sorry for your loss. But now it's time to take some responsibility and learn from your mistake.
     
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  12. koolykg

    koolykg Jr. Member
    Advocate (Facebook)

    Jan 1, 2016
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    Clock, if you read my whole quote to him you would see why I seemed so hard or shrewd, which I do not think I was. He compared his situation to a person that gets mugged. I do not know if Regen-X deleted it, but it is not on the thread now. As someone who has had a gun put their head, robbed, and tied up; I did not and do not take that analogy of losing coins to someone you gave your 33 word seed in the same scenario. No one put a gun to his head. He can tell me to fuck off all that he wants to, but my position still stands about taking responsibility and not playing the victim. There are a lot of scammers in the world of crypto-currency. @insoc plastered all over this forum about not giving away the 33 word seed. I feel empathy for anyone who gets something stolen from them, but there are times that we have to take responsibility for our actions and move on. I mean this situation is posted on two threads. @bttjob did not do all this. Let's try to keep this forum positive and not fall into the rhetoric of someone who wants us to feel sorry for them. This is a job for the developers and not us.
     
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  13. ClokworkGremlin

    ClokworkGremlin Sr. Member

    Jan 10, 2016
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    Whatever I want.
    In fairness, aside from my comment that I thought you were a little out of line, our posts are pretty much in agreement.

    It's like Nicholas Cage's character from Matchstick Men. "I don't steal the money. They give it to me." RegenX was rushing to give his money away.
     
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  14. koolykg

    koolykg Jr. Member
    Advocate (Facebook)

    Jan 1, 2016
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    Thanks Clock. We have been in this for over a month towards our road to financial freedom. Let's get this money baby!!!
     
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  15. ClokworkGremlin

    ClokworkGremlin Sr. Member

    Jan 10, 2016
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    Whatever I want.
    Well, the fact is, you're right. We need to keep the community attitude positive. It may be difficult with scammers and conmen running amock, willfully ignorant users, naysaysers crying "scam" just because they failed to complete the airdrop process, but the key to increasing market integration is for users of Decred to have a good experience.

    One is all. All is one.
     
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  16. RegenX

    RegenX Jr. Member

    Jan 2, 2016
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    I didn't tell anyone to fuck off. Did you even read it.

    I said that this is like having your car stolen and the police telling you to fuck off
    when you ask for help. Go read it again.

    I won't be replying to this bullshit anymore.
     
  17. ClokworkGremlin

    ClokworkGremlin Sr. Member

    Jan 10, 2016
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    Whatever I want.
    In defense of the police in this situation, you were handing your car keys out willy-nilly.

    Your coins should be assumed lost. If you learn an important lesson about trust from the experience, then they were well-spent.
     
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  18. koolykg

    koolykg Jr. Member
    Advocate (Facebook)

    Jan 1, 2016
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    I do not understand why you are cussing. There are other ways to express what you are trying to say. I misread your quote about telling me to fuck off. I still stand on my position about the situation. Look Regen-X, I do not condone stealing from anyone, but we have wasted over 24 hours with this. You and all of us who have spent time responding to this need to move on. Count your losses as a learning experience. You can not trust anyone when it comes to your money.
     
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  19. Shadowlance

    Shadowlance Full Member

    Jan 9, 2016
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    It should also be noted that the devs are unable (I'll say that again, UNABLE) to manipulate the blockchain to refund lost/stolen coins. Some of the posts I've seen from users who have lost their airdrop or given away their seed seem to think the devs are able to do something about it. I'm not saying that's happening with this poster, but some of the comments here and elsewhere at least seem to implicitly point towards that being a possible solution to their problems.

    The whole point of any cryptocurrency is that no-one including the developers are able to manipulate it (I know there are some network effects and situations where blockchain manipulation can occur but they require a lot of hardware and don't apply to this situation). The devs have been great at supporting users who have lost their coins (re: the Blizzy saga) but the best they can do is try to guilt the thief into giving them back, they cannot restore the coins.

    I will also add a note to would-be thieves: This case and the Blizzy case look like pretty clear-cut cases of fraud. Many jurisdictions are beginning to classify cryptocurrency as a commodity (and even the ones that don't will generally still see it is having value) so the victim could have the thief charged under criminal law. Don't forget that cryptocurrency, while anonymous, is not untraceable. In fact, every transaction is recorded forever in the blockchain. If your transaction can be linked to an account (such as an airdrop address), it can be followed back to you.
     
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  20. koolykg

    koolykg Jr. Member
    Advocate (Facebook)

    Jan 1, 2016
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    That is why taking something such as a few coins can cost the thieves more in the long run. You are right that it is a criminal offense and taking a few coins will cost them in the long run. @Blizzy and Jesse had a chance at being a part of something great with decred. Now they are S.O.L. due to their greed!!!
     

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