Pushing Dcr To Mainstream?

Discussion in 'Questions' started by drunkenmugsy, Feb 29, 2016.

  1. 2017/12/15 - Decred v1.1.2 released! → Release Notes  → Downloads
  1. drunkenmugsy

    drunkenmugsy Sr. Member
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    What is the path to getting DCR into mainstream use similar to bitcoin or better?

    I did follow bitcoin to some degree. The illegal dark side seems to have been what pushed the acceptance of BTC initially. Not sure we want to push that route...
    Has anyone given any thought to what we as a community can do to this end? Years ago before internet payment gateways became mainstream it was actually the porn industry that pushed internet transaction boundaries and brought them to the masses. Online porn membership sites were some of the first successful online business ventures.
    Bitcoin is getting a boost from currency flight out of countries with capital controls(re:China) maybe? With the volatility factor this can be risky or become a windfall depending on when you fly your money? hehe. Subverting a .gov is probably not the best way to go mainstream either. As new a DCR is I dont know that we can get the same public confidence as a store of value that bitcoin has gained. Even if BTC is tainted with a volatility factor people are willing to risk that in the face of currency devaluation.

    What should be our target?
    What can we do to enable acceptance in this target area?
     
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  2. drunkenmugsy

    drunkenmugsy Sr. Member
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    This goes without saying that there needs to be some kind of payment gateway allowing current money exchange companies to even offer this type of service to businesses. Very few will adopt until transactions can be simple and fast.

    There will also be a need to go directly from fiat to DCR. Only enthusiasts will take the step of fiat -> BTC -> DCR -> purchases. Why go to DCR if you lose money in fees exchanging from BTC?
     
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  3. Bill Threewits

    Jan 16, 2016
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    #3 Bill Threewits, Feb 29, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 29, 2016
    We must avoid centralization. This may be accomplished by means of a simple assurance of a change in the algorithm should an ASIC investment become apparent. Likely, no party would risk the $1million+ to call our bluff.

    Also, we must use the self-funding feature to pay genius programmers to innovate for the average Joe's easy adoption. Also, we must innovate for the average merchant to adopt for the nearly free transaction costs.

    Third, we must make it easy for the $billion BTC infrastructure to migrate to DCR. These Silicon Valley ventures will have no loyalty to BTC - only to their own success - DCR/BTC - no difference to venture capitalists.

    All of this will be effective only with the calculated use of guerilla marketing to publicize these developments/features. Guerilla marketing can certainly include a measure of notoriety. Also, investment opportunities such as a DCR ETF naturally get publicity. There are a million ways to get the word out through inexpensive channels to make Decred go viral. We must wait for the right time to do this; we start this phase when we are more developed.

    We will likely need an MBA to accompany the developers in order to get this right. For now, the Devs hold the keys to the kingdom. Soon though, a business mind will be necessary.
     
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  4. ZomaX

    ZomaX Member
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    This is certainly one tactic - replace Bitcoin. It could prove to be expensive, dangerous, and in my honest opinion, stupid. Just a few months ago, Bitcoin XT pointed out a giant weakness in Bitcoin, one that the media covered extensively. Bitcoin XT got a huge following, and was seemingly taking over. Though, it seems that Bitcoin has overcome this attack. Bitcoin XT has died down (died down - not died entirely). Partially due to Chinese miners and DDoS attacks by Bitcoin fanatics, the success that should have been Bitcoin XT has simmered down to what it is today.

    We simply cannot become the next Bitcoin XT, and this means that we need to look at this from a less aggressive standpoint. How has Ethereum survived this long (Seriously, it's literally worthless)? Litecoin? Peercoin? If we can't replace Bitcoin, we need to be everything that Bitcoin isn't, and that is decentralized right at this point. Achieving true decentralization is hard to say the least. If Decred can take advantage of this, then there will be no need to spend millions - billions even - dislodging Bitcoin from the minds of the public; the public will be more than happy to adopt it, and the investors will flock, with no fight needed.
     
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  5. sw1

    sw1 Jr. Member

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    My personal opinion is that there will be many mainstream crypto's in future (not just bitcoin), in which decred may be one.

    The biggest challenge all current crypto's face, including bitcoin. Is a state sponsored "fedcoin". If this was to happen within next 5 years, most "normal" people would flock to that and render the end of decentralized crypo networks. Cashless societies nearly exist in some parts of the world, Netherlands for example. Education is key!

    The central banks are already discussing this. Eliminating cash is there primary objective, they could impose neg interest rates and force you into spending and debt. Because you cant save if the coins expire after certain time etc..

    We need to educate the masses on why decentralised networks are better for society and provide much easier ways to use them.

    Lets take bitcoin, it has lots of inherent issues, centralised structure (miners/Devs), lots of VC investment (which means very rich people are trying to vie for control), fee's (which allow miners to prioritise payments), transaction confirmations are very slow (compared with visa/mastercard etc), links to dark web and terrorism (most likely scare tactics from banks but still enough to scare off joe public).

    Education at school level is needed, plus a seismic shift in peoples general intelligence towards technical advancement and an awakening against crony capitalism. While there is signs of a change (trump/sanders/corbyn etc in US/UK), the general population are not ready to trust themselves at being their own bank. You just need to see how many people on this forum have made mistakes, lost seeds etc to know crypto is a geeks world.

    If we cant make it easy for people to adopt, then we will fail as a community. So for me, that needs to be the focus.

    GUI everything, (almost) Instant transactions, shapeshift style currency changes and ATM access to fiat. While bitcoin has been around for 7 years or so now, they still have not been able to achieve all of the above. We at decred have to make this a priority to win the hearts and minds of the masses. learn from bitcoins mistakes, take the good ideas (LN etc) and get them implemented once we have a solid platform to build upon.

    I just hope we can do this before the "elite" do. Otherwise its curtains for decentralised crypto's.

    So tell everyone the benefits of decentralised crypto, dont get technical, explain it in ways people can understand. Send some coins to your kids wallets and let them play with it. We are doing this for the adults of tomorrow, to make the place a better world. That needs to be how we lead conversations. Not about mining or trading or profits or megahashes, no one cares apart from us geeks :)

    Over and out!
    sw1
     
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  6. Noah

    Noah Member
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    #6 Noah, Mar 1, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2016
    Great thread, this will be an interesting discussion.

    It's too early for Decred to become mainstream, I think right now we should focus on forming a tight community. Attract the best developers, improve and build upon current functionalities, and create a community that is able to withstand shocks.

    @Bill Threewits Yes, guerilla marketing works very well, but we need to keep it civil and polite. Aggressive tactics and fudding will work against us in the long run. Getting business minds on board is a great plan, although I think MBAs are a bad idea. We need people who understand the hectic world of cryptocurrencies, who feel comfortable in the chaos of technical development, public debates, and making sound business decisions. It would be great to have people who already managed an altcoin, who see the potential of Decred, and who would love to get on board.

    @ZomaX Agreed, decentralisation is our main priority. What's in a name: DeCred = Decentralised Credit.

    @sw1 That makes sense, Dude! This could have been one of my quotes: "We need to educate the masses on why decentralised networks are better for society and provide much easier ways to use them". I'm already spreading the news of cryptocurrencies in my network, and on Twitter I'm advocating like hell (not just for DCR, for blockchain technology in general). It's a very powerful idea to organise education at High School levels, I'd be more than interested to participate in this. Perhaps we can release a RFP on this?

    Let's keep this discussion going, I'm very interested to hear more ideas and comments!
     
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  7. sambiohazard

    sambiohazard Sr. Member

    Jan 21, 2016
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    I don't want decred to go mainstream, i want mainstream to go decred. IMO otherwise its as useless as fedcoin, people need to know how it works and use it otherwise they are better off with "mainstream" things.
     
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  8. LastNinja

    LastNinja Full Member

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    Best post seen here in days. You know why Bitcoin sucks since a couple of years. It has become govcoin.
     
  9. drunkenmugsy

    drunkenmugsy Sr. Member
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    I would totally disagree. It has become bankercoin as it is worth large amounts of money it has gathered their attention. They have to have their hands in the pot.
    Not only that, they see it as a threat. .gov and .bank see crypto coin they dont control as a threat. It allows anyone to transfer value without them. The price is set without them. Its creation is done, again, without them.
     
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  10. sw1

    sw1 Jr. Member

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    I know quite a few people involved in the upper echelons of bitcoins movement and I dont think it has become govcoin or bankcoin. Most of the folks I know are still striving to make it what it was set out to be.

    There is a growing community of vulture capitalists which are investing heavily in BTC/blockchain tech, as global fiat currency wars have caused huge unpredictable swings in forex markets, blue chip stocks are facing major market corrections (linkedin losing half their value overnight anyone??). Bear in mind.. not ONE tech company has IPO'd on wall street in 2016... That is major news. Deutche bank and credit suisse are almost insolvent. Bitcoin is seen as a great hedge against classic investments. Silver and gold too.

    Bitcoin was the best value return on any currency (inc fiat) in 2015, this gets the money men interested and that can be a danger. As a wise man once said... every man has their price. Investments in other normal trading markets are giving shocking returns, stocks/shares/bonds etc.

    So really bitcoin is a victim of its own success, but thats not necessarily a bad thing, especially for new crypo's with better protocols and community driven voting like decred. People are getting interested in crypto now. We need to harness this interest by doing what I said in previous post.

    IMO @sambiohazard has a point, we need mainstream to go decred and I think its entirely possible it could happen. But its up to us to advocate and provide the education that general people need to adopt crypto's as mainstream currency.
     
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  11. LastNinja

    LastNinja Full Member

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    Mainstream won't embrace Decred before there isn't a mobile wallet for Android and iOS. Not even a GUI wallet for desktops at the moment.
     
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  12. sw1

    sw1 Jr. Member

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    Very true ninja...no one can argue against that! See my first post for ideas. First one was GUI everything!!
     
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  13. sambiohazard

    sambiohazard Sr. Member

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    What i was trying to say earlier, is that, Bitcoin hasn't failed but people are failing bitcoin. They want comfort & willful ignorance instead of taking responsibility for their own money. I am not saying use CLI forever but know superficially what is happening behind the GUI & how to responsibly/safely use the coins & software.

    "I don't want to know how it works, if i can buy the next best thing i don't need and remain numb to reality, even if that includes trusting third party, loosing control of my keys."

    This is not designed to work like that and you will get scammed time and again if you keep using it like that. You are better off using conventional money. I hate it when people use crypto the wrong way and cry scam. Such users are just liability and bad publicity. There are genuine problems with crypto as well but they get solved or are being worked on.

    I agree with ease of use point by @sw1 but not by obfuscation but by building better tools that allow easy p2p use instead of middle man solutions just to have quick adoption.
     
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  14. LastNinja

    LastNinja Full Member

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    #14 LastNinja, Mar 2, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2016
    If you want to wait for happily ignorant people to understand the tech, you can wait to the end of days.

    None of them understands SMTP, TCP/IP, HTTP, SSL, yet they use email and www. Not to mention mobile phones!
    None of them has a clue how an internal combustion engine works, yet they drive cars since 100 years.

    Conclusion: They will never understand because they don't want to understand. But they still want to use it. So give it to them in a way they can use it. It's that way or no way.

    EDIT: Actually all humankind should be dead by now since none of them understand even the most basic Mechanics, the one that affects our daily lives. I mean literally 99.999% of the population doesn't know about the centripetal force and believes in the non-existing centrifugal force. And yet they are (well, mostly) able to drive a car around the corner without getting killed. Because engineers provide them a product that enables even the most ignorant people to use it without killing each other (mostly).
     
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  15. sambiohazard

    sambiohazard Sr. Member

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    yup that is the last point i made, we have to make tool/software that allows use in right & easy way. Right now we have tools that make it easy in the wrong way.

    Also internet was never designed t o be censorship resistant, although new tech like IPFS & meshnet & cryptography are now solving that problem, again the right tools to use it in right way. Cryptocurency is by design decentralized so we only need tools that keep it that way while making use easy. Point being don't compromise the key feature for ease of use.

    This is what whole blocksize/CorevsClassic debate is about. Core wants to preserve key advantages while improving usability while Classic is backed by VC/profiteers who just want adoption and control even if it comes at cost of loosing key advantages.
     
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  16. LastNinja

    LastNinja Full Member

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    I think you got that backwards. Nothing more VC driven and corrupted in BTC world than Borgstream with their almost $100 million of VC for perverting BTC with off-chain "networks" and their mining cartel and mafia style consensus meetings. Satoshi would be turning in his grave if he knew what jerks took control of Bitcoin.
     
  17. collecta

    collecta New Member

    Mar 2, 2016
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    I used the Decred web wallet code to build an IOS app for my personal use, it if its ok and there is demand i could release it on the App Store to give another wallet option.
     
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  18. sambiohazard

    sambiohazard Sr. Member

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    You need to read the core devs IRC and see their rationale. I trust them more than Classic Strongarm :D just like i trust decred devs.
     
  19. LastNinja

    LastNinja Full Member

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    I prefer to read Satoshi's old posts and his paper. There is no place in Bitcoin for a "trusted third party" or "trusted central authority". Especially not for one which has nearly $100 million of VC to pervert Bitcoin into an off-chain Lightning Network. We have that junk already, it's called Paypal.
     
  20. LastNinja

    LastNinja Full Member

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